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ELB Class Action Law Suit

+6
chillier76
bigrex
sailor964
pteadams2002
Brasidas
meteck
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Post by bigrex Tue 01 Oct 2013, 19:09

I didn't get to see the briefing because I was having fibreOp installed. Does anyone have a link?
bigrex
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Post by Guest Tue 01 Oct 2013, 18:27

I love the Ombudsman !

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Post by bigrex Mon 30 Sep 2013, 20:17

Meteck, it is your right to seek a functionality test, I was just saying that it is normally only requested after a Veteran is no longer working, or attending school, because of their disability and are seeking the TPI determination that is required for extended ELB. So to request the test while still attending school isn't likely going to produce a report to substantiate being deemed TPI. Because to an OT, for the purpose of this test, if you are healthy enough to sit in a class room for 4-8 hours a day, then you are healthy enough to hold a job in an office. And if VAC are reviewing every file of those getting ELB, they may see this and predetermine that any near future TPI claim is fraudulent. We all know that VAC uses benefit of doubt against Veterans, so why give them ammunition to possibly use against you? So, in your best interest, I would sincerely suggest you hold off on that test, as long as possible.

As far as the news conference, I would be surprised if the retro is discussed, because the nature of the report being released is looking at how to improve the NVC in the future, not the past, and I think one recommendation concerning ELB will be to make it a life long benefit.
bigrex
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Post by Guest Mon 30 Sep 2013, 19:11

cod ham cheese and rice, I say I appreciate the let go, will impose upon one's self to control that urge to be foul written, thank you Teen

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Post by Teentitan Mon 30 Sep 2013, 18:43

You know I try and try to monitor the language on topics. It's a job at times.

So how's about this proposal...let's make the above comment (which is bang on btw) the last language slip up and give ol' TT a edit break?

OK?
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Post by Guest Mon 30 Sep 2013, 17:08

Assumption is the root of all fuckups sorry to be blunt but when I read policy I ask policy orientated questions I ask no theory based questions because that is when I get rhetorical bullshit based on shite.

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Post by meteck Mon 30 Sep 2013, 11:06

big rex .I hear you but might be reading me wrong here. I am not happy that people stuck in the mental portion of the ride will be left hanging I speak to what I know. not what I feel ..your right every case is different and if anyone is paying attention the ombudsman has a national media conference at 10am tomorrow to hear EXACTLY what is recommended to fix so those on elb don't get squezzed out because of non movement forward in their quest for re-education. if this passes with no talk of retro for us all I for one will be very worried about it, the functional abilities test I thought was my right. so I asked for one. doesn't mean im not going to school cause I am. I guess at end of the day your right cases differ but I feel confident that what I believe to be true when it comes to policy on elb going forward is what I think. youl all have to trust your own beliefs I guess.heres hoping im wrong

meteck
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Post by Guest Fri 27 Sep 2013, 14:32

just to reiterate my point.

boys ya gotta keep in mind every case is different.

propat

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Post by bigrex Fri 27 Sep 2013, 14:10

Meteck, I think you may need to step back and take a deep breathe. But everybody that has responded to you, and you have responded to lately, are all TPI and approved for EELB, even if some aren't actually getting anything anymore due to being reinstated for SISIP. Propat didn't say everyone would get a lump sum, he said his CM told him that he would get one. So if you already knew about the retirement benefit, why tell him he was wrong? Also, nobody here has said that you are incorrect in your statements that VAC is looking to get people off ELB, if they can. It was just you're claim that they will no longer allow people with mental health issues to remain on the program, if they are still too ill to attend schooling, that rubbed some the wrong way.

One thing though, I will tell you right now, that having a functionality test, or even requesting one, while still in school is counter-productive. An OT will say that if you are well enough to attend class, then you are capable of holding a job, and by requesting one now, VAC may see it as that you are planning to not work once your schooling is over and simply collect ELB until 65, and look at any claim of TPI in the future with a little more suspicion.
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Post by meteck Fri 27 Sep 2013, 12:12

First off I am not offended by anyone. conversation is knowledge and knowledge is power.. I understand that if deemed totally impaired you will receive 2 percent at 65...for the other 98 percent ...we get NOTHING.. AND  if everybody feels they are safe from being expelled off elb good for you. my reality and my sources tellme a very different story. ive asked for a fuctional abilities test. while in in school.ive also asked for every monthly report done without my knowledge threw march of dimes. I may actually need to use the freedom of information act just to see my own progress reports while im still in school.. so I have my shit together thanks and im not a know it all nor do I pretend to be. what I am is wide awake and taking the struggle to them not the other way around. fantino doesn't even recognize our asking for retro for f***s sake. good luck to all.

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Post by Guest Thu 26 Sep 2013, 16:51

ya ya what he said lol. thanks bigrex.

propat

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Post by Guest Thu 26 Sep 2013, 16:12

First off an apology to Meteck no intent to tell you to f *** off your opinion does matter regardless of what I think or how lame it was, not that it was lame just stating that for the record. The problem with some of the posts are that they fall under heresy and are not based on specific cases period. The problem with this dissemination method is that it omits hard truths and very important policy criteria that either discredits the applicants or the policy management.
     I know for a fact that I was under the Voc Rehab program for a duration of 9 years (03-012) under the old 901102 policy. During those years I fought to have my monthly VAC Benefits as close to 100 % as possible. In 2012 I qualified for ELB (because of Wonder-boy and Blainey) however due to my entitlement awards I made too much to earn ELB . My VAC. Rep informed me that i no longer qualified to participate in VOC REHAB, I said back up lady are you cutting me off? No you qualify TPI and all we require is this form to be filled out and that you provide us with a medical update via phone questionnaire every 24 months. If there is change to your medical situation please advise us ASAP as it may reflect on your LTD (reinstated Oct 2012) being reduced if your able to participate in the work force. That was from my area Counselor aVAC employee. Ire-visit my injuries and submit annual updates to VAC regardless of the condition. I also submit every injury and doctor visit i have and why you ask, because the last thing I want to hear is, WE HAVE SEEN NO MEDICAL EVIDENCE THAT YOUR MEDICAL SITUATION HAS IMPROVED OR GOTTEN WORSE, well there you go lady next. I had emergency surgery last fall and even though those A's & B's are lit up on the bottom of my VAC card I still submitted a claim. VAC told me I do not need to do this and I told them that is ok because the surgery reduces my physical abilities greatly and I wanted the surgery documented as a non-entitlement resource. That situation they do not want to hear because that means more VIP services. Stay on top of your administrative requirement and make them do their jobs.

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Post by bigrex Thu 26 Sep 2013, 15:36

Actually Propat is correct.

From the VAC website.

Supplementary Retirement Benefit

A payment designed to compensate for the lower pension contributions made because you were unable to work as a result being totally and permanently incapacitated. This is a one-time, taxable cash award.

You may qualify for a Supplementary Retirement Benefit if you are:

a CF Veteran who is totally and permanently incapacitated and you no longer qualify for Earnings Loss Benefits because you:
have reached the age of 65;
or
are now able to hold down a suitable job.


From NVC regulations:

29. The supplementary retirement benefit shall be paid as a lump sum in an amount equal to 2% of the total amount of earnings loss benefit that would have been payable to or in respect of the member or veteran, as the case may be, if no amounts from sources prescribed under subsection 19(1) or 23(3) of the Act were considered in determining the amount of earnings loss benefit payable.


So the way I read it, it says that if you have been approved for EELB, when you are no longer eligible, there will be a one time taxable lump sum equaling 2% of what your total ELB earnings would have been if there were no deductions. So without taking indexation into account, my current ELB benefit amount is roughly $3950/month before deductions and taxes. Since I am approved for EELB until I'm 65, that will give me around 24 years of collecting the benefit. So when I turn 65, I can apply to receive around $23000 before taxes from this benefit. So people aren't going to get rich from this program, but it's better than a kick in the groin. Of course that is a long time away and gives VAC plenty of time to do away with the program, like it did with so many others that had originally been part of the Pension Act.
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Post by meteck Thu 26 Sep 2013, 14:09

well said big rex..I feel confident in my info and propat there is no lump sum at 65..that was a confusing point I have since investigated and found out that's wrong..ps..Julian fantino replied to a letter I sent to blaney and in it he reiterates that as of oct 2012 the clawback has ended and that they are currently working on amending it for the war veterans allowance but dint say jack about retro..i repeat..zippo...well I dint expect him to say heres the money we wrongly deducted for years but at least he took the time to send a letter..blaney never did...for what its worth im back on the fence as to if we are getting our cash back.i am saving large while im on this program..i suggest others do the same

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Post by bigrex Thu 26 Sep 2013, 12:26

I have to agree with Robbie. It is the mentality that all one has to do to fix a mental health condition is to want it fixed, as if it's as simple as taking a broken car into a garage and swapping out the part that is broken, that caused those suffering to hide in the shadows for so many years. I do think they will be cracking down on those getting elb indefinately, but if there is documented proof that one cannot attend schooling because of a physical or mental health, they will not cut someone off. The rehab program under the NVC ISN`T the same as SISIP, who only concentrates on re-training, and one can be approved for the rehab program for any number of reasons, including physio, counseling, psycho-social and never be required to set foot inside a classroom. So, IMO, the people who need to be on the look out are those who have completed the schooling, but have yet to find employment. If anyone feels this describes their situation, but feel their medical condition has worsened to the point of being unable to work, even in your new field, then you need to be proactive and seek the TPI determination NOW, or you will find yourself in the same boat as Supreme.
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